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I’m unvaccinated. Here’s what a PhD said to try to convince me to get the shot.

Science has been thrown into the national spotlight since 2020, as has National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases Director Dr. Anthony Fauci, a man who would otherwise be relatively if not absolutely unknown to the general American public.

Even common folk like a mom of 4 who teaches kids to cook now know him down to his Catholic upbringing, and we’ve all expanded our vocabulary to include words like “spike protein,” “viral load,” and “herd immunity.”

I was honored to speak at a TEDx event this summer, encouraging parents to raise children who become critical thinkers, a topic never more important than in this moment.

Katie Kimball at TEDx event

When I heard the breadth and focus of expertise of my fellow speaker, my heart quickened.

He’s a renowned researcher who has studied the effect of air pollution on the heart, figured out how to create chemicals needs for Covid testing kits in his lab when the supply chain broke down during the pandemic, and has proven that more serious COVID-19 symptoms occur in e-cigarettes users. I couldn’t wait to learn more from him. 

I wanted him to tell me something I didn’t know about the virus, the testing process, or the vaccine.

A part of me yearned for him to convince me that I was wrong, and that I needed to see a new perspective on the whole pandemic and the government’s requests. If anyone could do that, it would be this extremely intelligent, kind, Midwestern PhD with whom I was suddenly a happenstance peer.

I wanted him to say something that I couldn’t stop thinking critically about over the next few days.

And he did, when I asked just the right question.

Let’s Understand Science Better 

Backstage in the green room, he was having an academic conversation with another speaker about how science has been vaulted into the national conversation, and I couldn’t help listening.

“What people don’t understand about science,” he said, “is that it’s always changing. You have to follow the data, to adapt.” This was also a strong theme in his fascinating TEDx talk, and he followed up with a somewhat related example:

“When people say that vaccine was rushed, they don’t understand that the technology has been worked on for 20 years. It was just finally able to be completed because of the huge influx of money.”

And he would know.

He’s been invited to the White House to speak to both Barack Obama and Donald Trump while each was president of the United States, and he described President Obama as “wise, insightful, a great listener, really interested in learning.”

My interest piqued, my questions began to multiply. I set my mind on talking to this longtime friend of “Tony Fauci” at the after party, and I was thrilled to arrive just after him and join his family at a standing table.

TEDx event center

We commiserated on the atrocity that Stanford University scientists formulated “new and improved” e-cigarettes by shifting the pH, specifically making them more palatable to our youth. Teens were then plunged into an epidemic of their own with 25% of high school seniors using.

I told him I wanted to stamp my foot and jump up and down, throwing a proper toddler-style tantrum in righteous anger when he shared that info in his TEDx, yelling, “Scientists should know better!”

He gravely acknowledged that even science tips toward money, and marketing has always been this way.

See – I trust science.

I just don’t always trust the human beings communicating the science.

The possibility that someone’s money has paid for the science.

The policies made after human beings interpret the science.

Finally, we ended up directly next to each other after the table jostled when we returned from a trip to dispose of plates and utensils and get, “Hey, one more!” from the bar.

He asked about my YouTube channel, and we chatted about how content creators monetize online. His university is very strict about researchers making zero outside income in any way, which I appreciated. “You’d have to disclose that at the bottom of every single journal article, right?” I asked, to which he replied, “They pretty much own us.“

I was just ready to jump into my first burning question about the pandemic, eager to hear from an NPR correspondent on the virus, an expert, a real scientist who followed the data and at one point was creating 15,000 COVID-19 test kits per day in his lab-turned-production-facility.

That was when he chose to say, “I’m just so tired of talking about it!”

Well, shoot.

The Questions I Asked Anyway

masks on a clothesline

I’m not one to be intimidated, though, and I said that I did have one question, and he could feel free to tell me to stuff it if he didn’t want to answer.

He graciously accepted my query about his comfort level to travel and be un-masked in a crowded social situation. (I refrained from including the bit in my head about how his actions went against his friend Dr. Fauci’s official recommendations even for vaccinated individuals.)

Why are You Comfortable with Travel and Large Un-Masked Groups?

“Well, I’m fully vaccinated and boostered,” he said, reacting to my surprise about boosters even being available in early August 2021. “I work in a hospital, and I’ve had my antibodies tested multiple times. A level of 20 is considered protected, and mine are well into the 200s, so I’m good!” he grinned confidently.

He had also tested antibodies before being vaccinated and expressed deep astonishment that he had never caught the virus naturally, since all the college kids in his lab had contracted it (in social situations outside the lab) and the morgue was in the basement of his building. “The virus was surely in the airways, in the ventilation system…”

He tested antibodies, in spite of the fact that the FDA expressly recommended against that practice, both pre- and post-vaccination (sources: 1, 2). His scientist privilege allows him to feel entirely safe, even as the country is shocked to discover that these vaccines were never intended to prevent all infection, and many fully vaccinated Americans are landing in hospitals on COVID floors.

I couldn’t be waylaid by all my curiosity about the virus carousing in his university building’s airducts, because I needed to know about this “rushed science.”

I brought up what he said earlier in the green room, when he also revealed that he graduated with an NPR host who interviewed him regularly during the pandemic and was a close colleague with Kenneth Chien, co-founder of Moderna.

Was Vaccine Testing Rushed?

“I understand that the science wasn’t rushed, but what about the testing? Is it valid to say that we can’t know the long-term effects, simply because we haven’t had to time to study it?” I asked him. 

He misunderstood my question and talked about long haul COVID, agreeing with me that yes, we sure don’t know everything about the long term, since it’s a brand new virus.

I corrected: “Yes, that makes sense, but what about the vaccine as well? Is it fair to question the fact that we don’t yet know long term effects, even if the science is sound? Can we say the testing was rushed because we just don’t know?”

Instead of mind-bending insight, I received…validation.

He was pretty quick to agree with me that yes, either way, virus or vaccine, it’s a gamble long term.

We don’t know what we haven’t yet been able to observe.

I’m glad he was comfortable with my use of the word “gamble,” because earlier in the day when we found out why one of our fellow speakers was absent, we weren’t speaking the same language.

You could feel the collective gasp when our incredible volunteer organizers shared that one speaker couldn’t make it because he had COVID-19. Standing next to our lone PhD in the group, I was the one to whom he directed his comment: “That’s ironic.”

I doubled my gasp and couldn’t think of anything to say other than, “I don’t know if it’s ironic, but it’s terribly sad.”

My heart went out to this man I didn’t know who had the courage and dedication to apply for something on thousands of unrealized bucket lists, was accepted, had to wait a full year when our event was postponed, worked dozens of hours perfecting his talk, and then couldn’t participate.

That’s just…sad.

But he’s a scientist, not a writer, I thought, maybe he didn’t use the word correctly. After all, the only words he could come up with to describe speaking in front of President Trump were: “He fell asleep while I was talking.”

Later I realized after much contemplation that perhaps he meant that it was “ironic” for someone to contract a “vaccine-preventable” disease that one can so easily avoid. Perhaps he censored himself from saying, “Served him right.”

Or maybe I’m being unfair. I can’t know what his intent was with the comment. I do know he fully expected that anyone unvaccinated should wear a mask in large groups, like the one at which we were speaking shoulder to shoulder over apps and drinks.

I do know he has a cousin he “can’t even talk to” because she refuses to get vaccinated.

His disgust was palpable, and I wish the photographer would have caught a shot of my face at the moment of his revelation.

I can’t even guess if I veiled my true reaction well enough, realizing how opposite our views were and wondering if that would become clear soon.

Here’s the thing:

I’m a writer, not a statistician.

And he’s a scientist, not a mathematician.

But still, I would have thought it obvious: If 57% of American adults were vaccinated the week before we stood on a windy rooftop venue, simple probability says that quite a handful of people around him were unvaccinated.

He already knew I’m Catholic. (Not that that means as much as it should, thank-you-very-much Mr. “Catholic in word but not policy” President.)

He heard (and complimented) my TEDx speech, which outed me as skeptical of mainstream medicine.

As a scientist, I would have expected him to be constantly observing, playing detective with information like my brain does.

I expected him to question assumptions, only rely on facts, and be ready to adapt if something wasn’t as anticipated.

Yet he clearly spoke as if there was 100% chance I was a fully vaccinated Democrat.

The odds were against him.

I despise politics.

It was as if he was playing right along with the theme of the last chapter book my kids listened to on our long drives: Sometimes you only see what you already know.

I didn’t set him straight.

Why Should I Get the Vaccine?

Instead, I used a strategy from another speaker, who taught us that afternoon how to have great conversations. I asked an open-ended question.

“So, IF your cousin was using logic, what would you say as a scientist to convince her to get the vaccine?”

I felt like I landed upon the perfect question.

Now I had opened the Pandora’s Box.

Now I would get my insider information.

Now I would hear what I’d been waiting to hear, something that would convince me to make the jump, get the poke, and feel as protected as my new PhD cohort was.

I could feel in my bones that it was a monumental question and would get me what I wanted.

Maybe it was the alcohol talking – was it a Captain and Coke, or Diet Coke, in his hand? His second, maybe third…but in my experience, a man of his girth should take more than that to lose judgment and speak too much.

He leaned closer, his vaccinated, antibody-ridden face a mere 12 inches from my own potentially-infested nasal passages, and I caught my breath, anticipating the wisdom that would capture my attention for days.

In barely an undertone with little regard to the 10-year-old entrepreneurs selling lemonade just behind us, he said:

“I’d say, ‘Get the f&*%ing vaccine.’”

surprised look on face

Ah.

Them’s fightin’ words.

And I haven’t been able to stop them from replaying in my mind, dozens of times in 24 hours.

But Doc, tell your friend Tony that it’s exactly that attitude that won’t win any wars, any battles, or convince the educated unvaccinated American public.

The hesitant.

The skeptical.

Those who, in the true sense of the word ironic, filled a data set of 100% of the people he didn’t already know at the table of 7.

I wanted science.

I yearned for learning, to have my eyes opened about this vaccine.

Sadly, instead I learned that even scientists are human and may not always be able to choose to use logic over emotion.

Note: This article was published with permission from the PhD scientist, who really is very kind and gracious! He read the whole thing, edited one factual error I had, and gave his blessing. I wouldn’t have shared this story if it was untrue, unkind, or would potentially put his job in jeopardy. 

As you might have ascertained by now, I’ve done a lot of my own research on a host of health issues, the C and the V included.

In the spring, my husband asked me to put together an organized document of quality sources so that if he’s questioned about his position on the V, he can intelligently answer. Ok, he might not have said “organized,” because he knows me, but he was hoping for something he could follow at least…

I mentioned it in an email to my Kitchen Stewardship® community and asked offhand, “Would anyone like to take a peek at that, even if I don’t have time to organize and annotate it like a post?”

Over 100 responses came in!

But with my own kids finishing school and playing Little League, the Kids Cook Real Food summer camp, and preparing for my TEDx talk in August, I couldn’t even find a few hours to make it shareable.

All that is over now, so I scraped together a few work days and decided to present it live, like a chat with a friend walking through the document.

You can watch the recording and get a list of allllll the links if you’re interested in

(a) having some “organized” info to intelligently support your own decision reasoning

(b) learning from a non-mainstream-media source about current research as you wrestle with your own decision

or

(c) feeling like you’re not alone if you don’t want to take sides and yell at other people.

Join the KS community and you get to be a part of it all: 

I’d love to take a look – thanks!

If you’re already signed up, log in here to view the free speech reader’s only content.

Please keep in mind that I’m not a doctor, nurse, scientist, CDC employee, or politician. I’m just a mom who reads a lot, cares about her kids and all of humanity, and still doesn’t know if she’s making the right decision. I explain what I’ve learned so far, just like I would for my husband so he can hang out with his buddies who might ask him questions about his decision.

PS – To address all the skeptics, who are WELCOME here – you’re among friends. 

  • Some will say that because I have ads on my site and/or affiliates, they won’t listen to a thing I say. Great. Don’t watch. This is my family business and (a) I will spend more on Zoom than these ads will possibly make me, and (b) it’s a lot riskier to to my business to do a webinar on you-know-what than if I just stayed in my lane and talked about food. I don’t even have anything to sell at the end. But if you believe it’s about profit, go find another source. It’s a big Internet.
  • Some will say that because I don’t have any science/medical degree, they don’t want to listen to me. Please, go somewhere else. 
  • Some will say that I shouldn’t password-protect some of my more controversial posts, that I should own what I believe and be up front with it. To be clear, anyone who is in my KS community (i.e. on my email list for free) can read and share password-protected posts with others. They’re protected from the eyes of search engines and big tech who pretty much determine how much traffic I get (which has been slashed by about 70% in the last few years). So I’m not hiding from humans, just overly powerful computer programs who like to censor things. 
Unless otherwise credited, photos are owned by the author or used with a license from Canva or Deposit Photos.

78 thoughts on “I’m unvaccinated. Here’s what a PhD said to try to convince me to get the shot.”

  1. Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I have been completely baffled why people are fearful of taking the shot. I have read here that you , Katie, don’t want to live in fear of the virus, but aren’t you living in fear of the shot? We do have clear evidence of the effects of getting covid. They are not pretty. I know I have people in my life who have either died or are living with the effects of long covid, and no, they are not all just ‘old people.’ I would be surprised if you have not also known people who have been affected by covid. We do not have clear evidence of the effects of getting the shot yet. I can’t quite figure out why people would not be more afraid of the clear evidence of getting covid, rather than the unknown long term effects of the shot in the future? For me, the clear mathematical gamble falls on the side of getting the shot, especially when I can help prevent the spread to my elderly mother and brother and sister in law who are fighting cancer. Fear of the shot seems more a fear of something we have no proof of …imaginary at this point?
    I am a strong Christian as well. It also baffles me when fellow Christians question my faith because I have gotten the vaccine. To me, that would be equated to Noah being questioned about his faith because he built an ark to evade the flood. The Pilgrims who originally came to this land had an incredibly strong faith, but many succumbed to illness and died their first winter. Faith does not necessarily prevent you from getting ill, but I believe God has given us tools as a defense. To not use those tools does not make sense to me.
    Those are my thoughts…thank you for letting me share them and for sharing yours. Yes, there is a possibility of adverse effects in the future…I think I will cross that bridge when I get there. For now, I would like to be as safe as possible from the current reality.

    1. Usually, people have addressed concerns that have not been addressed by their doctor, pharmaceutical company, or government. It’s a falling out that will get worse over time. We must side with those people before it happens to us.

    2. Oh, that’s horrible that people questions your Christian faith about a vaccine, in either direction! Medicine isn’t about faith, one way or the other. 🙁

      For me, it comes down to:

      1. There’s not 100% chance one will get Covid, but when you put a vaccine in your arm, you start with 100% chance of having it.
      2. So many people don’t get ill effects from Covid, and there are at least remedies that can mediate those effects. With the shot, there’s nothing you can do to counteract some of the potential long term effects, at the DNA level.
      3. I’m not living in fear of the shot. Just not choosing it. That feels different than shuttering myself up in my home and refusing to see family members because they might be carrying a disease that for my family has less than a 1% chance of death and pretty low percentages of other ill effects. Although I’m working on quelling my fear of the mandates taking away my freedoms…gotta offer that up to the Lord since it’s out of my control, but also looking to see what I can do to fight them.
      4. You said you could prevent the spread to your loved ones, and that’s where media propaganda is winning. At this point even the CDC director is on record saying the vaccines aren’t able to prevent the spread. If anything, it feels like a false sense of security and a tragedy that people may be spreading the virus more because of that.
      5. The possibility of adverse events in the future is already the reality – thousands of people have died from the shot or are permanently disabled, even young people. For my 16yo son, I look at the research out of Ontario showing that his risk of hospitalization from Covid and from vaccine-induced myocarditis is exactly equal. I’ll take my chances with the natural spread of disease, even if it’s an unnatural disease. 🙁

      Plus my family has all had Covid already, which has to play into our decision. We are at even greater risk of adverse events from the shot because of that.

      I have zero judgment against you, your decision, or your faith. It’s a beautiful thing that you wanted to do this to protect your loved ones. And it’s a beautiful country that we can both make those choices based on what we think is best.

      In Him,
      Katie

  2. I almost did not read this but I was curious…

    Thank you for sharing all this information and for standing up for the truth. I agree with your thought processes and also that we must train out children to be critical thinkers. I am blessed to have attended a classical Catholic high school and college. My children also have this privilege. We must raise adults for the future. Sadly, I notice how so many people in our country cannot think for themselves. Keep up the good fight.

    1. Hi Michelle,
      I do wear a mask when people feel uncomfortable when I don’t have one on, but thus far, I have yet to be convinced that they are as effective as they need to be to compensate for the risks. Luckily, I work at home and am rarely out in the community. Thanks, Katie

  3. I’m still confused if I should get the shot or not. I had covid in late July. My doctor says it okay to get the shot now. I also heard to wait 3 months so I’m getting confused on what to do. What’s the deal with having the shot and having organ shut down. I’m trying to make a good decision. Still wondering what I should do.

    1. Joanne, from what I’ve read you do not need the shot. You have naturally immunity which trumps anything the shot will do, even to the variants. I personally want more information regarding the shot. My doctor who is a holistic doctor has recommended to me to wait. Wait and see. Give it some time to make sure you read all the facts. Once you take the shot you cannot reverse it, at all.

    2. JoAnne,
      I would read Dr. Elisa Song’s excellent article on natural immunity: https://healthykidshappykids.com/2021/07/24/why-natural-immunity-should-must-count/

      Just b/c your doc says you “may” get it doesn’t mean you must say yes. Blessings on your discernment, and may you have peace with your decision! Katie

  4. Wholeheartedly agree, the title of the article was misleading. Glad to see that people can disagree and still be civil.

    I was quite surprised, until quite close to the end of the readers’ comments, to see that only one person made mention of the alarming fact that no treatment was ever offered for this virus. Instead, receive diagnoses, go home and wait for symptoms to worsen. When in history has this ever been the case?

    1. Becca @ The Earthling’s Handbook

      Patty, what do you mean, “no treatment was ever offered for this virus”? Since the very beginning, people who have been hospitalized with COVID-19 have received treatment, with the specifics evolving as doctors have learned what works and what doesn’t.

      For people not sick enough to be hospitalized, it is true that there has not been much treatment beyond “rest, drink fluids, take medication to reduce fever”—but throughout history, that has very much been the standard for viral infections. Haven’t you ever had the experience of going to the doctor, very sick, and being told, “It’s a virus. You’ll just have to wait to get well.” ?

      For example, in 2014 my entire family came down with bronchitis when I was four months pregnant. We had throat swabs that determined it was viral, not bacterial, bronchitis so antibiotics would not help. There was no treatment other than home remedies until I reached a point of uncontrollable coughing and vomiting, for which I was given IV medication in the ER.

      I’ve been reading that there is a pill in development which could treat COVID-19, even mild cases to prevent them from getting worse. It is no surprise that such a drug was not available earlier and that medications known to be effective against some other viruses did not work on this one, because this is a *new* virus and viruses are notoriously difficult to treat.

  5. Thank you for this post and conveying a position many of us are in. I am a registered nurse. I had C in March as well as my 5 children. They basically had colds. For me it was different and harder but I did ok- it was more the anxiety from all the fear and such that made it worse. I have since tested positive for a good number of antibodies. We did have another positive a few weeks ago in my oldest son and then another son got sick again. It was beyond mild- less than a cold so immunity works. I took care of them and never got sick. I am now in the position of losing my job and 22 year career due to mandates with no exemptions. I feel I already had the risks of having covid and should not be forced to take the very real risks of the vaccine as well. I always give my patients the freedom of choice even if I disagree and believe a treatment could be lifesaving etc. – everyone should have a choice.

    1. Carolyn @ Kitchen Stewardship

      Oh wow, that’s rough Amy! We definitely need to be taking natural immunity into account. I’m sorry you’re in this position.

  6. Hi Katie,
    I just wanted to tell you I appreciate your honesty and willingness to remain “undecided”. Your words are thoughtfully written and it’s so refreshing to read someone who isn’t so eager to jump into conclusion (one side or the other), but to carefully weigh the risks on both sides. Please keep us posted of your further development on this topic.

  7. Hi Katie!

    THANK YOU soo much for all of your research! It is so interesting to read everyone’s comments. Like you, I am looking for something to convince me, but I think the best thing I can do is boost my immune system and stay out of the hospital. As an RN, I see the full hospitals and the stress it is putting on staff. I have recently been listening to Dr Livingood, who states C Thrives off of inflammation and those who get thrown into a cytokine storm are doing the worst.
    I agree with you. I am very concerned about ADE. We are not going to see this until a few years out, so it has NOT been long enough to know what this is going to do. I think it is wise for the elderly and high-risk to get vaccinated, the last thing they need is to be in the hospital with C. But I have seen soo many with C who only had a headache, or a sore throat, so I’m convinced it would be worth it for them to take the shot, and then possibly end up with organ failure in 2 years. Especially when they already have Natural immunity after having C.

    1. Thanks for your perspective as an RN, Meghan. I am concerned that the hospitals are filling up, and I do with that more research could be done on treatments. I didn’t know ADE doesn’t always show up until that much time has passed. 😮 I wish we had vaccinated the most at-risk as well, and I’m very firm that we mustn’t be mandating any medical procedure. Individuals must be able to assess their own health and risk factors and talk to their doctors. Mine, consequently, has actually said that he doesn’t recommend the vaccine for me or my husband, and my children’s pediatrician says the same for them. Neither are anti-vax in any way, just assessing the data.

      Is your healthcare system going to require the shot? That worries me for so many of our doctors and nurses, especially those who already have natural immunity. Very sad that they’re being required to take a “medicine” they don’t need. 🙁

      This is all just…messy.
      Thank you for continuing to learn and share!
      Katie

  8. Sasha Worthington

    I think this is very disingenuous. I don’t believe there is anything this PhD (or any person who knows Faucci or is part of “mainstream” science) could have said to you to convince you. It comes across that you want a 100% guaranteed safe (now and forever,)100% effective vaccine that is 100% going to stop the pandemic in its tracks.

    You believe in God (as a Catholic,) believe that a few words transmute wine and wafer into the body of a dead prophet, yet do not believe in science because of the money. I suggest you follow the money related to religion too. Who benefits from these beliefs? Who benefitted in the past? Has religion changed its stance based on new situations?

    What answer did you want to hear from this PhD? What could someone say or is there no point because until there is an accumulated 20 years of data, which you have faith in, show this particular immunization to be safe and effective you are not interested in being vaccinated.

    1. Sasha,
      I do think it is important to listen to both sides of an issue. Dr. Peter McCullough is a world renowned expert on the subject of viruses, and he has recently been censored and discredited. It seems that anyone with a differing viewpoint from the mainstream narrative gets shut down. Why is that? The docu-series on V** questions has been eye-opening for me. The discovery of the VAERS documentation recording all the deaths and serious side effects from getting the vax are shocking. Any other vax would have been halted based on these numbers. Yet nobody is reporting these. Also, when you follow the money and see who is benefitting from the vax, it does raise concerns. Finally, those who are seriously asking questions seem truly curious, whereas those who are aggressively pushing for all of us to get vx’ed seem very angry. One researcher on the film series said that to be a true vaccine, there are five criteria that must be met. Pfizer and Moderna do not meet any of the five, but J&J does. The others are simply injections. Find out what the other side is saying and why. I believe the truth will eventually come out. They cannot suppress it forever. I also think it is important to be civil in these types of discussions.

        1. Vsecretscc.com. Done by medical journalist Jonathan Otto. The first night, over 200,000 tried to watch and their servers crashed. YouTube keeps deleting the content. Mainstream media is aggressively trying to silence them.

      1. Sasha Worthington

        I think my comment was misunderstood. I’m not pushing the jab. I am pointing out that Katie seems to have decided not to get it and there is nothing this PhD could have said to change her perspective. That this scientist “blew it” by showing his frustration only seems to have confirmed Katie’s view.
        Why is money the underlying issue for this and not for other situations? I think if money is the real reason to distrust scientist then there are way more institutions, whose recommendations are just accepted, than public health/CDC. Being selective about challenging motives adds to dismissal by both sides.

    2. Hi Sasha,
      Since you asked, for me personally, a few pieces of data need to intersect:
      1. The severity of the disease needs to be high
      2. The vaccine needs to be effective at reducing transmission significantly
      3. The vaccine needs to have a safe profile, which, YES, will take time, at least a few years, although I would be willing to get a shot earlier than that if conditions 1 and 2 increased greatly.
      4. Ideally, herd immunity ought to be an option (because this isn’t a sterilizing vaccine, it’s really not), and I’d like someone to convince me that variants are caused by the unvaccinated, not the vaccinations themselves, as Geert Van Den Bosch has been sounding the alarm.

      I don’t need 100% guarantees, but for now, for me, the current numbers aren’t compelling.

      1. Sasha Worthington

        Thank you for the ongoing engagement.
        Can you clarify severity as defined by which measures? Death rate? Long term health issues, hospital usage, time away from work/parenting/life? COVID-19 is being found to have more and more lasting negative effects on those infected. What about the 250K people who have died so far in the US? Is that an exaggeration, a lie, not from this cornavirus, or is that not a large enough percent of the people infected to be considered severe? Is there another disease circulating that is also vaccine-preventable that would be consider severe enough?

        Is the definition about severity to an individual? That it is not that big a deal and you cannot see yourself in those affected significantly? It is a fact there are young healthy people having heart attacks, strokes, debilitating fatigue and brain fog, after infection. People who went from competitive athletes in great shape, working full-time plus other coaching or side-gigs, writing and creating art are now unable to work, drive or follow a 30 minute TV show. That seems pretty severe. Many of these younger people did not have what would be considered a severe illness at the time of infection. They did not go to the ER or seek medical attention until after their initial illness. Neuroscientists are discovering changes in the brains of kids who had COVID-19 that are permanent too, not related to the severity of the initial infection. No data yet on the effect these changes may have on their future cognition. So many of the people who caught COVD were doing all the “right” things.” They did not have the option of not working or working from home. They were masked, washing their hands and trying to physically separate themselves, many of them caught this virus from others who were not following the recommendations.

        The position of sitting back and gambling that you won’t get infected and gambling again that if you do catch C it will only be a mild illness is very very privileged. A position of privilege not to have to worry about being able to pay the bills should you end up out of work or even fired for getting sick. Not to have to worry about going bankrupt from medical expenses should you end up in ER, acute care, ICU or requiring rehab. Not to have to consider that if you are unlucky enough to have long term repercussions you will still be housed, fed and clothed. Privileged that you will always be able to get health insurance even with pre-existing conditions caused by COVID. And lucky you are healthy and will not need to access any healthcare services while they are already full of critical ill COVID patients. No need to worry about your pacemaker insertion, your hip replacement, your gynaecological surgery or any hospital-based treatment will be delayed or unavailable because the beds are full. No worries that any treatment you might need will be at a significantly high risk of errors as the staff are scarce or stretched so thin.
        There is no easy way to predict who will have severe short or long term outcomes from catching this disease. Yes, there are some with pre-existing conditions however many that die or are irreparably changed were young, healthy eating, active, with nothing to suggest they would be disabled, damaged or deceased.

        1. Hi Sasha,
          I thought we were up to 650k deaths? The US is certainly taking the gold medal in deaths. That said, yes, death rate (percentage of those my age who get it and pass away) is a big factor. How treatable is it? There are so many doctors saying that this is a relatively easy virus to treat, and many are having success treating long Covid too. I do think the long-term effects of the virus are alarming, for sure, but so are the effects of the vax. Folks are having strokes, heart attacks, and dying from that, too.

          I’ve noticed that many who catch the virus were doing the “right things” which makes me question whether those recommending those things really know what they’re saying. Maybe we can’t control the viral spread at all.

          The death rate of those under 50 is farrrr less than 1%, and even the 50-70yo range is not super scary, not as scary as say, beating cancer.

          I’m trying to figure out if it’s privileged to hope that if I get it, I would be able to beat it without a hospital, if it’s optimistic, or just a hope based on facts about our family. I think you’re saying that others aren’t as lucky as I am, which I guess means that I should be doing more advocating, I should risk my livelihood to spread the word about inexpensive treatments that are being censored. I’d rather do that than risk my health with a vax, although I’m not sure that would be worth it/make sense.

          Bottom line is that right now, medical freedom is at risk. I will never change my mind about that fact that requirements to take a medical procedure infringe on basic human rights. That conversation has unfortunately become more important at this juncture.

  9. Hi Katie,

    I’m afraid I’m not with you on this one. I was hoping that someone actually collated the evidence to help convince for not against vaccine, even if I guess I wasn’t convinced that that was where this one was going.

    I’m not your high-brow scientist who has been in the thick of all the research but I am a medic who has been seeing the effects of Covid, and I’ll give you my logic.

    No, these specific vaccines haven’t been around long enough to know long term effects but they are produced with science that has been around long enough. So much so that it could fast-track their production. They will have a more ‘controlled ‘ outcome than the virus itself can ever have. So if we’re talking about taking a gamble with one’s health, I would take, and have taken, the least risky one.

    I can understand the bristling against being ‘compelled’ to take a vaccine, or anything for that matter. That’s human nature. However if western society was less consumed by the notions of My choice, My health, My body, My beliefs and still believed in Greater Good then the world would be in a better place on many other issues.

    No vaccine was ever portrayed as being 100% effective so I dont know why anyone should be surprised that there are still people who are contracting the virus and why some are still getting pretty ill. You will have to admit that the numbers are much lower however.

    And no, the vaccines also never guaranteed that they would eliminate transmission of the virus. However you will also have to admit that if the majority of people, bar those who cannot for actual contraindications, Do get vaccinated, there will be less virus going around, and less chance of new variants cropping up. Not to mention less people getting sick.

    I can also understand the hesitancy to completely trust science and the powers-that-be because it would appear that money talks everywhere. I know I lost some of my faith in WHO at the outset of the pandemic when it first insisted people shouldn’t buy or wear masks, against all logic, only to then back-track and insist we should. I lost lots of faith in my department when they at the outset of the pandemic insisted they would not provide us with n95 masks and that we should not procure our own as donning and doffing them could increase our risk of contracting the virus. Please, I felt my intelligence was being totally insulted. I would have preferred being given the raw fact that there weren’t enough to go around and that we should leave the stocks available to the intensivists who were at greater risk than those in my speciality. I would have preferred WHO to likewise state the same and appeal to everyone’s sense of Greater Good. But ah….we do have a problem there…

    It is however unfortunate, that given your opportunity to have an intelligent discussion with a scientist who may have given you better answers, you were once again fobbed off with a condescending ‘just get the effing vaccine’. Sadly, science often comes with a sense of intellectual entitlement. Perhaps universities would do well to invest in credits which improve on emotional intelligence within their science faculties.

    Sadder still however are the comments of people who said they almost didn’t read because they assumed you had capitulated and had been convinced to take the jab. Let’s all cover our ears and make sure we bury our head in the sand lest we hear one word that might shake our resolve to not be vaccinated.

    Lastly, could this virus have been manufactured in a great money-making conspiracy? You know what, I wont even bother going there…the end result is that it’s here. The world isn’t what it was when the Spanish flu was around and travel, with the ensuing continued spread, is ubiquitous and almost inevitable. I want normality back. Do you have any better suggestion to get us there?

    1. Hi Lara,
      I appreciate your polite discussion and definitely your perspective as a medic. We agree on a lot of points, most especially that wayyyy too many people do not take steps for the greater good (kind of what my blog is about, stewarding the earth and our health for the long term), and also that it’s *not* OK to stick one’s head in the sand, however tempting that is, and hold fast to an idea just because it’s the current decision you’ve made. Science changes, and I’m willing to listen when it’s compelling.

      Thus far, it’s still up for discussion whether getting vaccinated or not getting vaccinated actually pushes the variants, or if those are just going to happen either way. Sources conflict. 🙁 And there are some very smart, experienced voices saying that the very act of mass vaccination during a pandemic when spread is inevitable will create not only more, but more virulent variants and some that will escape the vaccine. 🙁 So that isn’t a clear choice.

      I’m so sorry your department chose to deceive rather than trust its own staff last year. Truly insulting to your intelligence and humanity. 🙁 So many human errors in the last 21 months or so…

      As far as normality…there are some who said we should have locked down those most at risk (the elderly and immune compromised) at the beginning after the curve flattened, allowed a little community spread once we knew how to treat the virus, and particularly now (well, 6 months ago) should have done similarly with vaccinations. Vaccinate the elderly – where long-term adverse reactions aren’t as much of a risk – and allow the young and healthy to obtain natural immunity, since it’s certain that this virus and its variants will not be eradicated. It’s here to stay, so part of getting back to normalcy is accepting that, reducing the fear narrative in the media, and embracing the fact that no one is getting out of this world alive. Perhaps fear of death is driving too many emotional decisions lately.

      I don’t want to see the hospitals and morgues overflowing, but the statistics on age stratification are very stark. It’s the elderly, mostly, who are being taken by this thing. Protect them. Let the kids build community immunity and study THAT to see if it holds up against the variants and lasts longer than the vaccinated immunity. Because the vaccine doesn’t prevent transmission or infection (i.e. it’s not a “sterilizing” vaccine), it will never eradicate this thing. We can only build up our best defense, which is likely a combination of vaccines, natural immunity after recovering, and simply bolstering our health to reduce co-morbidities.

      That’s my best shot, and it allows personal choice and science to be at work. Thanks again for your intelligent words and thoughtful conversation. I’ll be opening up the webinar tonight reminding people to get their heads out of the sand, in fact.

      Grateful, Katie

      1. Becca @ The Earthling's Handbook

        “Let the kids build community immunity and study THAT to see if it holds up against the variants and lasts longer than the vaccinated immunity.”
        The kids’ bodies have had a year and a half to work on this…and the result is that the virus has mutated to more effectively attack kids.

        Of course we should study natural immunity as it develops, but it is not happening fast enough to control the virus. That’s why we need to keep on with vaccination, social distancing, hygiene, masks, EVERYTHING we can do to reduce the number of people the virus infects. More viral particles in existence = more opportunities for mutations, and more bodies colonized = more viral particles.

        1. Becca,
          But not really – The kids have been masked, separated by plexiglass, quarantined, in virtual school, hyper-sanitized, etc. Some say 50% of kids have had it already, but official numbers are far less than that. The truth is likely somewhere in the middle because surely not all pediatric cases were tested, partly because they might have been mild/asymptomatic or because parents didn’t want to put their kids through the test. (?) The virus has mutated to be more contagious, but Dr. Elisa Song looked at numbers with Delta and said it’s not more severe, just that more people are getting it. There’s so much conflicting research and learned opinions/predictions, it’s mind-boggling.

  10. Caroline Tobin

    This is your money quote from this article (figuratively, i mean, since in the world we live in, it would be enough for you to be completely demonetized)

    “I trust science.
    I just don’t always trust the human beings communicating the science.
    The possibility that someone’s money has paid for the science.
    The policies made after human beings interpret the science.”

    Looking forward to the webinar

  11. Melinda Stortenbecker

    Loved this. Especially after having to endure over 3 hours of being harangued by my 30 yo son who has bought into the fear and taken the shot.

    I will be very interested in seeing the info you’ve compiled. I’ve done my own research and come to your same conclusion, but didn’t keep it in any order so was unable to logically help my son, who is finishing up his own PhD, realize that we’re being vastly limited on the information being carried by the mainstream media.

  12. I work in health care and over 80% of hospitalizations are people that have not been vaccinated.

    1. Christine-
      Katie says that she’d be happy to be vaccinated if she saw a reason to do it.
      How is this not a reason?!

      1. Hi Cort – Totally understand. That’s a reason for “me” to get the shot, but not for the “we” i.e. the community. As long as I feel confident that I can keep my own behind out of the hospital, there’s not a significant risk to the community if I’m unvaccinated. See more in my reply to Christine. It’s just not a black and white issue. Thank you, Katie

    2. Hi Christine,
      Yes, I understand that. And I do believe we need to make sure we don’t overfill our hospitals (or understaff them). So for me, the “we” part of the vaccine is that we need to prevent the hospitals from running out of space. Most of the science otherwise points to it being a “me” thing (personal protection most of all). What state are you in, out of curiosity? Of course percentages need to be looked at in light of percentage vaccination in the area. If 80% of your community is unvaccinated, for example, that number means nothing. If 80% are vaccinated, then we need to look at the age groups in the hospital I suppose.

      The data coming out of Israel, the first country to achieve herd immunity numbers (80% of adults vaccinated), are showing that either the immunity wanes after 5-6 months or the Delta variant is a bit too powerful. For my age group, the risk of hospitalization is only decreased about 2-3x, which to me isn’t incredibly compelling to take a risk on a medical procedure we haven’t had time to study in the long term. Israel’s rate of infection right now is 5.4%, pretty significant, and their cases last week equaled the worst week ever, back in Jan. 2020. So real world data, I’m not sure we’re seeing that the numbers are playing out quite as predicted. I hear what Becca is saying, that the vaccine prevents infection. It is supposed to…and it seemed to for a while…but with Delta, things are shifting quite a bit. In fact, I saw numbers in Florida for July only put Pfizer at 40% effective in preventing infection, which is a far cry from 95%. https://www.thejournal.ie/israel-highest-daily-figures-covid-19-5536210-Aug2021/ https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2021/08/20/1029628471/highly-vaccinated-israel-is-seeing-a-dramatic-surge-in-new-covid-cases-heres-why https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/8/23/israel-struggles-to-cope-with-surge-of-covid-infections-despite-v

      My point is that there is still significant risk hanging out with vaccinated people, because they still may be infected, but in some ways they’re more likely to be asymptomatic — which could be worse since they’d be more likely to remain in society instead of staying home to rest and heal.

      I appreciate you sharing your statistic and really do look forward to hearing what state/area you’re in so I can put those numbers in context. (The mainstream media is saying that only 1-3% of those hospitalized are vaccinated, so your numbers are already in disagreement with those stats.)

      When I truly believe that the vaccine is a community effort, and that my taking a risk in the long term will help others significantly, both in the short AND long term, I’m there. Although – I’ll test my antibodies and T-cells first, because if I have natural immunity, I’m not messing with it (unless data convince me otherwise, but for now, that question is pretty clear).

      Thanks again,
      Katie

      1. Christine Tupper

        Hi Katie,

        I am in Alberta, Canada where close to 80% of those over 12 have received one dose and close to 70% have received both doses. The vaccine is not 100%. I could very easily still get covid but I continue to wear a mask and social distance. Masks are soon to be manditory again in all businesses where social distancing is not possible. The unvaccinated population can also have covid and be asymptomatic. If you take ICU admissions – 97% are unvaccinated or partially vaccinated.

        1. Thanks Christine. It’s clear that the vaccine is helping reduce hospitalizations, which is important with Delta being more contagious for sure. I think age breakdown would help understand the numbers even better — I appreciate the perspective that the elderly, the most at risk, possibly should have been the population to be vaccinated as much as possible to really make the biggest impact on the hospitals and overall community health.

          Yes, about 59% of transmission, according to one study, was asymptomatic (pre vaccine). Approximately half in fully asymptomatic cases and half in pre-symptomatic cases. That’s why I just can’t live in fear – I’d like to see people able to make their own choices, fully informed, and then be left alone to bolster my immune system (fear depresses it big time). It would be easy to be fearful wherever I went, thinking that anyone I met could be getting me sick. That’s literally the truth, but I have to choose what I’m fearful about. I don’t want to be fearful of people. In fact, did you see the study showing that anxiety/fear disorders are actually the second leading comorbidity with death from Covid? https://www.cdc.gov/pcd/issues/2021/21_0123.htm

          I’m certainly taking all of this into account and again appreciate you sharing the numbers. 🙂 Katie

      2. While all the sceptics keep kicking their heels before they have their shot we’ll keep getting all the letters in the Greek alphabet in variants, nullifying the sacrifice/leap of faith/community effort all the other took in taking it.

  13. You’re disappointed that the man wanted a night off? He even told you he was sick of talking about it. Did he realize you were going to write a whole blog post about him, from his “antibody-ridden face” and every other mean and weird detail you could think to include? As a healthcare provider, I would be really angry to have something like this written about me. I’m vaccinated and have lost many friends that I’ve had to cancel outings with, as I’m not willing to increase my risk of stillbirth just to see them when they can’t get a vaccine to protect others. And no, I don’t really want to debate with them about it, either. I’m exhausted from discussing it with my patients day in and day out, the patients that I have an obligation to care for. I don’t want to talk about it with friends or at a social event.

    1. Hi R,
      Thank you for your honesty. I should be clear that I asked permission from this scientist, and he corrected one factual error in the post and graciously gave his blessing for it to be published publicly. He and I have had some wonderful back-and-forth via email (where he still hasn’t been able to come up with any compelling evidence about transmission to convince me).

      Is there a risk of stillbirth with the virus that you can catch from unV-d people that you can’t catch from V-d people? Recent research is showing that V’d individuals carry as much viral load in their nasal passageways when it comes to Delta as unv’d individuals, so your risks of contracting may not be reduced depending on which friends you’re willing to spend time with.

      Again, if I could be convinced that my inoculation would have a significant chance of helping you, I would consider it strongly. I want to be generous and charitable and make sacrifices for others. But currently data are not compelling. 🙁

      Everyone at the TEDx after party was asking questions about our talks, and I did the same. I really thought I’d hear something new that might convince me to get the shot. But hopefully it helps you to know that this was published with permission. He’s really a kind man.

      Thanks again for sharing your perspective, and I’m so sorry this time is such a stressor for you and other healthcare providers — Katie

      1. Becca @ The Earthling’s Handbook

        Katie, it’s not that the virus in the bodies of infected-despite-vaccination people is different from the virus in the bodies of unvaccinated people, it’s that vaccinated people are significantly less likely to become infected with the virus if exposed. So by associating only with vaccinated people, R reduces her risk of exposure to the virus by about 80%. Since she also is vaccinated and that reduces her risk of getting infected (when exposed) by about 80%, the combination is 96% effective protection for her and her baby.

        1. Hi Becca,
          I do understand what the data is saying. I just want to give this thing time to play out in real world situations, since we’ve seen numerical models in the past 20 months end up inaccurate. Please see my response to Christine about the numbers coming out of Israel’s real world situation. I realize the science wasn’t rushed, and many say that adverse reactions usually show up in the first 2 months, so we’ve had enough time. It’s just not enough for me. There’s ADE to be concerned about, vaccine escaping variants, or long term adverse reactions like autoimmune responses, hormone effects, or heart disease impact. Do you have a source on the “significantly less likely to become infected?” The trouble with the numbers right now is that many states have stopped keeping track of whether non-hospitalized cases are V’s or Unv’d, so it’s actually really difficult to make that case.

          R’s unborn child will likely have antibodies too, which is actually really cool – same happens with breastfeeding and also with natural immunity. It’s lovely that she can make that choice to protect her baby.
          Thanks for sharing,
          Katie

          1. Becca @ The Earthling's Handbook

            Although the effectiveness of the vaccines has dropped now that delta variant is involved, it is still true that vaccinated people are significantly less likely to become infected than unvaccinated people. So even if the vaccine is only 40% effective, R’s vaccination cuts her risk 40%, and then her associating with only vaccinated people cuts the odds of anyone around her being infected (and contagious) by 40%, so the combination is about 64% effective–not perfect but a lot better than nothing.

            80% is the estimated vaccine effectiveness in the U.S. since the emergence of delta (down from about 95% before) that I’ve been seeing in the news and anecdotal reports from health care workers–but you’re right that the statistics on non-hospitalized cases are rarely and inconsistently reported.

            As for hospitalization and death, scroll to the second table and “show all” to see that unvaccinated people are 5 to 448 times as likely to be hospitalized for COVID-19 and 7 to 87 times as likely to die of COVID-19, depending on conditions in their state. Even “unvaccinated people are 5 times as likely to be hospitalized” is the same as “vaccinated people are 80% less likely to be hospitalized,” so I’m still glad I got vaccinated.

            Here’s a study from India about the effectiveness of vaccination on preventing symptomatic delta cases: 88% for one of their vaccines and 67% for the other. (Both were more effective on alpha variant.) That’s still not addressing asymptomatic cases, and the vaccines used in India are different from the ones in the US, but there’s still some useful information here.

            It’s important to realize when we look at the rate of spread in the overall US population–in which July-August 2021 looks so similar to June-July 2020 before vaccines–that in the spring/summer of 2021, many local restrictions were lifted and many vaccinated people thought they could “go back to normal” in exposure. That unfortunately increased spread of the virus among unvaccinated people (including children) and the 5% of vaccinated people who were vulnerable, and that’s what got us to where we are today. It’s not because the vaccines “failed” but because we didn’t wait long enough or vaccinate a large enough proportion of the population for them to work as intended. We also may be seeing the need for a third shot about six months after the second.

            R’s unborn child is more likely to develop antibodies ***because R was vaccinated***; that may be what you meant by “that choice,” but I want to make that clear. Unvaccinated mothers who haven’t been infected don’t have antibodies to pass along. Mothers who developed antibodies by surviving infection have 87% chance of passing antibodies to the baby, whereas for vaccinated mothers, it’s 99%. (The 87% article is unclear on whether all the moms were unvaccinated, but if you click through on the two studies cited there, you’ll see both were conducted before vaccines were available.) Although 87% sounds good, the article explains this is low compared to most other infections–and R would not have even that much ability to arm her baby with antibodies without getting infected with COVID-19, which as she said increases risk of stillbirth.

            I’m sorry that one arrogant scientist–who was taking risks I, as a fully vaccinated person, haven’t taken at any point in the pandemic–was rude to you and didn’t give you a good reason to get the vaccine. Here is my reason: Although there could be unknown long-term effects from the vaccine, there are also known, serious, common, short- and long-term effects from infection with the virus. Therefore, the risk of suffering from the virus is much higher and worse than the risk of suffering from the vaccine. The vaccine reduces your chance of catching the virus, and if you catch it you could spread it to someone who would suffer more than you (as a paragon of health) would, including your own children and their classmates. Therefore, to do your best to reduce the suffering of humankind, please get the vaccine. The Pope says you have an ethical obligation to make this small gesture of love for humankind.

            1. Thanks for sharing all those studies, Becca, I appreciate it. I’m glad that the vaccine is preventing many from needing hospitalization; that’s really wonderful. And yes, only recovered and vaccinated mothers can pass on antibodies to unborn or breastfeeding children, thank you for clarifying that.

              We disagree on what side effects are likely worse, the virus or the vaccine, although I know long-Covid is absolutely awful. Part of my equation is that if I take the shot, I have 100% chance of getting it. If I don’t, I only have a ?% chance of getting Covid and dealing with those adverse effects. So that’s part of it. And I know the Holy Father has recommended the vaccine. That weighs on me. I guess I just see it as a “medium to large” gesture of love that may or may not actually help humankind. I’m choosing to “wait and see” for now, and so far, as we see efficacy wane and controversy over booster shots surge, and as conversation about natural immunity vs. vaccine immunity swirls, I’m glad I did. I want to wait a little longer, but I appreciate your gentle nudging.

              Thank you, Katie

              1. Julie Holland

                Katie, people do not get covid from the vaccine. You might have some side effects, but the vaccine does not give you covid.

                Having watched my mother die of covid before the vaccine existed, I would strongly recommend you take the shot. You do *not* want to watch your loved ones suffer and possibly die from this horrible illness. It truly is an investment in the health of our communities.

                Maybe you’ve already seen this, but just in case: https://www.christiansandthevaccine.com/faqs

                Take care, and know that I respect you no matter what your decision is.

      2. Becca @ The Earthling’s Handbook

        Katie, it’s not that the virus in the bodies of infected-despite-vaccination people is different from the virus in the bodies of unvaccinated people, it’s that vaccinated people are significantly less likely to become infected with the virus if exposed. So by associating only with vaccinated people, R reduces her risk of exposure to the virus by about 80%. Since she also is vaccinated and that reduces her risk of getting infected (when exposed) by about 80%, the combination is 96% effective protection for her and her baby.

      3. Many thanks and blessings to you, Katie, for all your research, recipes, reviews and sharing your knowledge. I, too, am hesitant to V due to some health conditions and disbelief of what the powers that be say. Especially, as someone noted, when the lying is obvious, i.e. that we didn’t need masks in the beginning and whenever outrageous money is being made it seems people don’t care who they hurt.

        We have often seen what happens when companies do whatever it takes for shareholders, like the Toyota airbag fiasco, the faulty Firestone tires, and melamine in pet food to up the protein count. My doctor told me to wait with V and I agree. I don’t think anyone has the right to force anyone to take a substance which could have not only instant irreversible damage, but also long term effects. Thank you for presenting what you know and explaining your thought process.

    2. Cortney Frandsen

      R- I wholeheartedly agree with you. The poor guy probably needed a night off from talking about it.
      Also, maybe he hasn’t tried to convince Katie because he can see how deeply entrenched she is in the anti-science, anti-mask, anti-vaccine camp and he knew it would be wasted breath and wasted energy.

      1. Hi Cortney,
        We also communicated via email. I’m open to all discussions, but I’m deeply hurt that you have labeled me as anti-science, anti-mask, and anti-vaccine. None of those are true. And again, I repeat, I’ve had email back-and-forth with the PhD, who is a lovely, gracious man. He gave full permission after reading this article.
        Thanks for remaining courteous,
        Katie

  14. I was really excited about this article because, like you, I want it to be true that the vaccine is safe and beneficial so we don’t have to continue to be at odds with everything this day in age. But my stance keeps getting more confirmed no matter where I look. I’m looking forward to this webinar and appreciate the work you put into it. It takes a lot to dig for the truth, especially when there’s so much conflicting positions.

  15. I must admit when I first read this I was disappointed and confused. Especially when you mentioned the scientist was a friend of Fauci. Sorry, Fauci has lost all credibility with me and anyone that is associated with him is not trustworthy, in my opinion. But, I see after reading the comments that I missed the punchline as well. Thank GOD! Thought you went off the deep end for a moment. I am looking forward to hearing the information you have gathered. I personally do not intend to take the death shot. I’ve been listening to as much as I can and that’s the conclusion I’ve come up with. There is a docuseries starting on August 30th with Dr. Christiane Northrup, Dr. Peter McCullough, and many other experts called Secrets of Vaccines. I’ve listened to Dr. Mercola, Dr. Zelenko, Ty & Charlene Bolinger of The Truth About Vaccines, and so many others warning about the danger of this vaccine. Keep us the good work Katie!!

    1. Maybe I need to brush up on my writing skills…or at least write better for the skimming habits of the Internet age. 😉 You’re right, I’m still vxn hesitant, but I really am open to learning — so far no one has been able to show me anything to convince me that I should do this for the good of society. See you Wednesday! 🙂 Katie

  16. I’m glad I read the comments. I was surprised that you would be fooled into being poked. I’m thankful to know that we think alike in many ways, jabbing included. I’m still a little confused, but I think you have implied in the comments that you have not received or intend to receive a vccn.

    1. True! I was just so intrigued to be rubbing shoulders with someone so connected to those who seem so out of reach, and I really did think that MAYBE he would have some information I didn’t know. Clearly he didn’t. Hope to see you Wednesday! 🙂 Katie

  17. I am sad to say I have lost faith in you and. your blog.
    You should have listened to these people impeecably resumed professionals below.
    Dr. Peter McCullough
    https://rumble.com/vhp7y5-full-interview-world-renowned-doctor-blows-lid-off-of-covid-vaccine.html
    Dr. McCullough is an internist, cardiologist, epidemiologist, and Professor of Medicine at Texas A & M College of Medicine, Dallas, TX USA. Since the outset of the pandemic, Dr. McCullough has been a leader in the medical response to the COVID-19 disaster and has published “Pathophysiological Basis and Rationale for Early Outpatient Treatment of SARS-CoV-2 (COVID-19) Infection” the first synthesis of sequenced multidrug treatment of ambulatory patients infected with SARS-CoV-2 in the American Journal of Medicine and subsequently updated in Reviews in Cardiovascular Medicine. He has 40 peer-reviewed publications on the infection and has commented extensively on the medical response to the COVID-19 crisis in TheHill and on FOX NEWS Channel. On November 19, 2020, Dr. McCullough testified in the US Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs and throughout 2021 in the Texas Senate Committee on Health and Human Services, Colorado General Assembly, and New Hampshire Senate concerning many aspects of the pandemic response.
    Peter A. McCullough, MD, MPH, FACP, FACC, FAHA, FCRSA, FCCP, FNKF, FNLA
    or this Doctor:
    https://theplantstrongclub.org/2021/08/26/dr-christina-parks-testimony-for-michigan-house-bill-4471-hb4471-on-8-19-21/
    You also need to keep track of all the VAERS death and serious injury reports… this jab should be pulled immediatley.
    https://www.openvaers.com/covid-data
    Almost 14,000 deaths!!! and over 100,000 serious side effects.
    My nephew who is 24 is in ICU, with 6 brain clots and not expected to make it after his jab. I know more people injured from this jab then serious outcomes from actually getting covid.
    You are NOT a critical thinker. You gave into the fear… what is needed is early treatment which is being surpressed. They never could have gotten EUA if a safe and effective treatment was available …which there are multiple. Follow the money trail.

    1. I think her article was titled as an attention grab… the article reveals what a scientist told her that he would tell someone else to convince them to get it (spoiler alert: it wasn’t convincing!)

      Prayers for your nephew, I’m so sorry that he is having to walk through that.

    2. Hi D. Jewell,
      I love what Dr. McCullough has to say, 100%. Also, I’ve interviewed Dr. Christina Parks as well and have watched her powerful testimony for the Michigan House Bill (my state). I’m SO sorry to hear about your nephew. Stories like his need to continue to be shared – the clot issue and the myocarditis are terrifying for our young men, who aren’t really at risk of the C anyway. I’ll be discussing all these data on the webinar. I think maybe…you didn’t read every word? Not once did I say I was fearful, or that my V status has changed. I’m open to any and all information, but for the foreseeable future, we’re on the same team here.

      Hope to see you Wednesday, because we really need to be able to present our information with good sourcing and logical arguments, pulling emotion out of it (unless sharing about family members with tragic stories like yours, breaking my heart to hear about these young people).

      Blessings, Katie

  18. I think the title means, not that he CONVINCED her to get it but that that was all he could say TO convince her to get it, sounded like more of a threat than a reasoning. Thanks Katie for all the great work you do.

  19. Maybe I am too tired, but I feel like I missed the punch line. What did he say to make you want to get the jab? Or is that an ironic statement based on his lack of tact answer?

    1. I was a little confused too. I think the title should read “what a PhD said to TRY to convince me”.

  20. Patricia Riddle

    This was an interesting read. As someone who has not gotten the jab, I am always on the lookout for more up to date facts.

  21. Thank you for this! I tried to sign up for the webinar but couldn’t get the link to work. May have been my computer. I’ll try again but, just in case, if you have a list of names to receive the recording and resources after, I’d love to get it. Thanks, Katie!

    1. Hi Andrea! I was going to just manually sign you up, but since you’re not already a member of the KS community (i.e. on my email list) I didn’t feel right about doing that w/o your express permission. Do you have a sec to try again? Or email [email protected]ship.com with a request and we can add you officially. Thanks for your interest!
      🙂 Katie

      1. Glad you added the word “Try” to the title Katie! I almost didn’t read the post based on the title in the email because like the other commenters I thought the worst. Glad to have read through the article and other comments and to learn I misunderstood! I have trusted and learned a lot from you over the years, and look forward to continuing to learn more!

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